Meetings and mishearings
Yesterday I was in a meeting from 10 a.m. until 5.15 p.m. with all my faculty colleagues in the music department (that’s about 15 people in all). Fortunately we were sitting around a big table so at least I could see everyone, but since only about 30 minutes of the meeting was really important, I got irritated at the amount of effort it takes to try and work out what they were saying. So much of it could have been done by exchanging emails…gah. Anyhow, as the day wore on, I was getting worse at concentrating (this will be a familiar feeling to everyone here). The amount of effort it takes is way too exhausting unless there’s some point to it. I mean, how often do I go to bed at 10 p.m.?
Fortunately I didn’t have to say anything specific except for a bit
of pre-planned support for something one of my friends was proposing, so I lurked for most of the time (and it was a squarish table around which we were sat, so at least I could see who was talking) and threw in the occasional semi-witty comment (which is my way at meetings). In one case I made a suggestion based on what I thought I’d heard and the looks of complete confusion around the room suggested I’d not quite got it right. We were talking about the new building at the time…so when I *thought* someone said something about having “a nice cafeteria”, I said “so
long as the ground floor doesn’t end up looking like Starbucks?” Why, oh why did I not just shut up?…I was surprised to be met by looks of total confusion. One of my nicer colleagues passed me a little note: “She was talking about ‘admissions criteria’ What did you think she’d said?” So at least there was something to laugh about afterwards. 
January 14th, 2006 at 1:50 pm
Nigel- Admissions Criteria: Students must not look like they spend too much time hanging out at Starbucks! Makes perfect sense to me.
I hate it when I do that, and tend to remain silent all too often as a result. =\
Maybe I should just forge forwards, and make the comments, and if people look confused, say “Oops. You obviously weren’t talking about what I just thought you were talking about. Hrm. Maybe if you all talked a litttttle bit slower, or used the notebook?”
But I doubt I have the courage to do so. =\
January 14th, 2006 at 5:16 pm
likewise, that happenes all the time to me in college and i end up looking like a right tit! but i learn usually a new word in lipreading though so i guess thats good !! but yeah it can be quiet embarrising too, what i really hate tho is how tiring it can be, I used to be an insomniac in secondary school, (Highschool) and now I could sleep just about anywhere!!
January 14th, 2006 at 6:40 pm
Sara - I know exactly what you mean about not having courage – I’m a total coward about risking my deafness being somehow obvious in these situations – and I’d spent most of the day *not* saying things in case they were stupid. I just thought it was time for a bit of a joke…unfortunate timing though
Lette, you’re so right about the tiring thing. I just came home and wanted to crash in a heap. I’m not normally like that!
January 14th, 2006 at 7:13 pm
Some day I want to have the courage to just laugh out loud and say “Wow, now THAT was a blooper, eh?”
January 15th, 2006 at 9:11 am
I don’t knock cowardice, without it bravery would be redundant, and I like heroes. Just a suggestion though wouldn’t it be courageous to stay for the half hour you wanted to contribute and then make your excuses and leave. Doesn’t semi-witty mean nearly funny. You reflect back the boredom you experience passive-aggressively.
People who like you or are nice will let it slide, but this is academe, there is always gonna be that punk kid in the music department sees you as the old fogey who has nothing to contribute apart from unfunny comments which are never ad rem. Not deaf more ignorant stupid and arrogant, the comedy ageing don. And the only way to the Chair of Music is over your rotting corpse. And what would you do if you return home before 10.00pm. Nobody on their death bed regrets that they did not spend more time at the office.
As for silence I dunno, often if i wait long enough someone says what I was gonna say. Few people really listen. And that does seem to be a problem with deafness. You can become scapegoated for carrying the symptoms of the group. Nobody listens. Some daydream. Some are texting on their mobiles. Some are bored. But you clearly haven’t got a clue what was being said at all now. Even I should be tempted to declaim the outraged virgin soliloquy. BTW they call it courage for a reason. Have none of you ever been bullied? Courage isn’t needed to speak out and admit ignorance, misunderstandings, bloopers, unless you already anticipate the bullying that may follow. At my age if I look for trouble I sit down comfortably, it will find me.
January 15th, 2006 at 1:49 pm
From my experience hanging out with Nigel, I doubt that anyone thinks of his “semi witty” comments as anything less than truly witty and amusing.
And unfortunately, cutting out of meetings early–EVEN IF YOUR PRESENCE IS NON-PRODUCTIVE (as mine always is)–is considered to be an indicator that you’re not a team player. Or it can come across as arrogant- wanting to have your say, but not wanting to listen to what others have to say. (Despite the fact that we… uh… can’t hear what they have to say anyway. And more than make up for the lack of meeting-ability in other areas.)
January 15th, 2006 at 2:43 pm
I tend to shy away from group meetings..after all, I’d rather create than talk without struggling to understand what others are talking about. On a one to one meeting, it’s easier to deal with and I don’t think about my deafness but when it comes to groups, it’s like a rude awakening for me..
January 15th, 2006 at 3:43 pm
At meetings, I pull out for as long as possible. So when I finally do have to give input, I BLUSH. It’s terrible! I hate having all those eyes on me while I wonder if I’m repeating word-for-word anything someone said before me (which happens more than I’d like).
One funny mis-hearing I had happened at a small, casual meeting. While we were all grabbing our seats, I happened to be bragging about something- and a coworker made a retort that I didn’t quite hear. I don’t remember what he actually said, but this is what I thought he said:
“Well. *I* used to have a talk show (so there!)”
It depends on the situation, but I usually like to share my bloopers.. it adds some levity to serious discussions.
P.S. Nigel, a meeting from 10-5? That sounds miserable! I start whining if meetings go over two hours!
January 15th, 2006 at 7:16 pm
DesieX - I hope I don’t give the impression of being 100 years old – but your mention of me being seen as some kind of “old fogey”, an “ageing don” (at 49? tell me it isn’t so) and climbing over my “rotting corpse” suggests otherwise (actually they wouldn’t have to do that – mine is a Personal Chair for my research rather than an administrative one, and if they want the admin, they are welcome to it).
Sara – thanks for your lovely comment re hanging out: I’d say exactly the same back at you (and how much I’m looking forward to next week
). And I would agree with you completely about cutting bits of meetings. It’s always seen as discourteous, arrogant, diva-like, whatever, no matter how good and genine the reasons. Basically, you have to stay the course and put up with everything that entails.
Sanctum – totally agree about 1-to-1, and something much more concrete can actually be achieved in that setting as well, I find.
Katie – 10–5.15, with 45 minutes for lunch. You’re so right about the misery factor! My tolerance is usually about the same as yours – 1.5 to 2 hours. And yes, Sharing bloopers can be a great thing to do.
I’ve got to go to sleep now…flying to the USA tomorrow morning! *bounces*
January 15th, 2006 at 10:29 pm
Can’t wait to see you again, Nigel.
Have a great flight!
January 16th, 2006 at 6:03 am
It seems Nigel has come down with you Sara, but first my abject apologies. At 49 you are a young stag handsome charming individual, I am tempted to propose marriage meself, far be it from me and I’ll come back your first paragraph at the end. I seemed to have got your attention just before take off too.
Perhaps then one serious point if you feel the urge. A Deaf political view appears to be that as a Deaf person you have skills and abilities that become disabling only when able-bodied society refuses to recognise the gift. Mutatis mutandis let us take famous Artist X who is otherwise illiterate. We tell him from now on he cannot paint unless he provides us with written plans, precis of the work he intends to paint and he can’t plagiarize or ask others to do his work. We stop him from painting. It seems a simple enough concept.
Sara pushes this strongly. In meetings your gift has no way of showing itself. You cannot hear anything but you could contribute if you were allowed to work outside the meeeting. You then attend solely and Nigel agrees to prevent projections. Neither of you claim mind reading skills but you believe the projections of arrogance Diva etc would be drawn on to you even after the explanation you have given. Presumambly you do not believe I will believe you. I am willing to be convinced. But this is the thing.
Alongside the Deaf political theory there is Sanctum’s view of the Artistic mind. Doers don’t like attending meetings. I don’t like attending meetings. The reason I go is because decisions get made there so it’s better to be there when those happen. Although most meetings it seems decisions are prevented from being made there. Similarly my phantasy is I wish they would hand out the hidden agenda and not just the agenda. Coz it takes a while to figure out what the unspoken problems are.
But if what you were saying were the whole of it, Society’s response to the Deaf political problem posed might be to offer a sign interpreter. The argument being but then you would know what was being said as it was being said. I have heard either lette or Sara say that the interpreter falls behind conversation. If that is not sufficient what would be sufficient to enable you to make use of your gift? The Deaf political position is about not allowing society to disable the deaf. Neither is it about giving you a letter from your mother that says you don’t have to attend the boring bits of life.
If I may comment again Nigel. My point on wit is that it always has a victim sometimes the self. And that perhaps you use it in meetings passively aggressively, as any Joker of the group does. But as Sara notes, what do i know, she has met you I never have. and as Sara notes in her last post, we are looking-glasses for each other, you need more than one to get the bigger picture. I don’t believe you were hurt to the core by my comments, I think you are pretending to be hurt for comic effect and it’s part of your impressive arsenal of witticism of mass destruction. But if you were really hurt once again my abject and unreserved apologies to you. it was to get your attention even the main point wasn’t that important. let it slide perhaps then.
January 16th, 2006 at 4:55 pm
understood, and very well told, but the proplem is most of the time, for me anyway, is I have begun to shy away from contributing in class, or in meetings, mainly because I miss quiet a lot more than Id like to admit, one on one I can ‘almost professionally’ handle, but group discussions do tell me where I stand!
and that is the very problem that is not being adressed, Because of my difficulty, I am shying away from the things I like most, and because I say nothing, and go home and have to work harder to catch up, behind closed doors, it goes unnoticed, and then everybody else think, oh well she is getting on grand, simply because i dont want to draw attention to my ‘problem’ and cass a fuss!! when I know It would be so much easier if I would just shout it out!! and I notice the majority of times my lipreading is good that my tutors and friends actually forget the fact that I cant actually hear them!! But I get so damn sick of repeating myself!!!
January 17th, 2006 at 6:06 pm
I am still learning so maybe I have misunderstood. In the UK with the Disability Discrimination Act recently in force all public companies are required to make reasonable adjustments if they are given advance warning. So if you ask for a sign interpreter currently that would be someone trained to Master’s Degree or NVQ level 4 minimum then they will provide one. But if you don’t ask they are not required to provide one. My daddy told me once, if you don’t ask you don’t get. By the way that also works with boyfriends if faulty memoryy serves. Tell him what you want and it should be enough that he wants to please you. Unless you are testing for psionic powers in which case what is it with wimin?
January 17th, 2006 at 8:02 pm
Desie,
The problem with disability discrimination acts, deafness, and interpreters, is that there are more deaf people than there are interpreters. In the USA, we frequently get pawned off on an “interpreter” who has had two months of community college training, and that can’t tell their sign for “ass” from their sign for “elbow”. When I was in high school, I suffered through this until I couldn’t take it any more and ended up dropping out.
Now I’m personally (FOR ME- not for anyone else) anti-sign language and anti-interpreter. I want a CART system- as people that are trained to use CART tend to be signficantly better-trained, and I don’t worry that I’m taking an interpreter away from anyone would would benefit from it more than I do.
January 18th, 2006 at 6:19 am
now that is interesting that you say for you personally you are anti-sign language you want an english language sub-titling system. You have said before written english is your preferred choice for communication, and you write elegantly.
From what I can gather what defines the Deaf community in the UK is BSL, their sign language, and that is their gift, their beautiful graceful elegant way of communicating without words. My understanding is that I too would be welcomed into the Deaf community if I can sign fluently and show an understanding of how to construct thoughts in BSL. They are not bigots, they argue.
It seems by that definition you are more someone who doesn’t hear very well, who wants to live in the world of the hearers.
Would it be fair to compare you to a mexican who wants both citizenship of the united states and an end to discrimination so you can pursue the american dream, whereas your compadres in the Deaf community are Zapatistas who wish to offer an alternative, better way of life both to americans and the rest of the world? No way would that be one sentence in BSL.
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:31 pm
“My understanding is that I too would be welcomed into the Deaf community if I can sign fluently and show an understanding of how to construct thoughts in BSL. They are not bigots, they argue.”
May I recommend that you join and read the Deaf-UK email list. I am sure you would find it extremely interesting. It can be found at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/deaf-uk/ .
January 23rd, 2006 at 5:51 pm
hey Natalya i think that is the place for me, some hardcore stuff, a bit of whining about sub-titles but some right on dudes. I saw one post saying that a hearing person learning BSL is to the Deaf community what a Wigga is to the Black community but then I saw a post from a deaf whitey boasting how he screwed a Thai Deaf Arts and Crafts shop of money he didn’t need. So I guess you have cuntz everywhere. think i found the place for me though. Have signed up will post soon. might even get a job out of it. many thanks for the webpage.
January 23rd, 2006 at 7:31 pm
Desi,
I am deaf. Little D. I see no reason for me to abandon my culture-of-birth when I should be able to live in it. Yes, it would be more convenient for me to join another community (in theory) I don’t want to. It’s as if I were a black person, born to a white family and then was told all my life “you should go back to Africa.” It’s utter bullshit. Yet, at the same time, I’d totally understand anyone that chose to take that route- because (theoretically) there is less discrimination, there is easier communication, and there is shared experience.
By the way, one thing that I tell every “hearie” that wants to join the “Deaf” community is this: Yes, you will most likely be welcomed with open arms. But you need to be sure that you’re doing it for the right reasons. If you’re into it because the language genuinely appeals to you, or because you want a job as an interpreter or because you want to work in a field that requires you to learn sign language- go for it. If you’re into it because you’ve got some weird messiah complex and want to safe Deaf people by lending them your ears and your hearie-ness, then it’s absurd. When people go into something to “save” deaf people, they’re ultimately rejected and resented.
(Note that the term “save” in this context is not the religous term.
)
January 23rd, 2006 at 8:31 pm
no chance of anyone getting saved by me sis. you never seen Yojimbo, he spins his sword on the ground and takes whichever fork it points to. Liberia was the american experiment with the black return, a whole new screw up for Africa.
I am not convinced a genuine culture is something you can choose but then I am more influenced by Spock in Star Trek the Motion Picture. He goes through this whole routine of forsaking all to pursue the priestly vocation of logic and makes the final initiation which happens to a vulcan only once or twice in every generation, then the high priestess (atrocious casting by the way americans don’t understand what a British luvvie Dame is) anyway the priestess says i sense a disturbance in your concentration or something in vulcan. And Spockie says. I feel a call. Whence comes the call. Pointing to deep space from out there. And she says Then you must go. Curtain falls shock horror among the multitude.
If an african american tried to return to Africa, they’d treat him as an american. I am an African, but I don’t think I can go home. Then again I have heard americans say america no longer exists (well Simon and Garfunkel to be precise).
I am not as opposed to mustabatory thinking as many modern thinkers. It used to be called deontology. As for right reasons does spinning my sword and taking the fork to which it pointed count as a right reason?
On the whole I’ll put money on my feeling rejected and resented even though I have no intention whatsoever of saving anyone least of all meself. But I am open to surprises. People still surprise me. One other thing, call me a hearie again and I expect you to add a smilie, is that fair enough bitch;-)